April 2023
 

Re: 'The Union has always been evolving'

I was interested to read Andy Goodliff’s thoughts about the evolving structure of our Union. His analysis suggests that changes have often been reactive and finance-driven, rather than proactive and guided by missional objectives. I smiled when I read that, as we often dress up such changes in the language of “being led by the Spirit”. (But perhaps I’m being too much of a cynic!)

I’ve been a Baptist long enough – an attender since 1971 and a minister since 1987 – to have personally witnessed the changes of the last half-century. These have of course taken place during a time when Christians’ denominational affiliations have grown much weaker (no longer will most of us, when moving house, specifically seek out a church of “our” denomination) and – let’s not kid ourselves – when churches in general have been in rapid decline. Both of these factors, together with many others such as increased mobility and different attitudes to “discretionary activities” and church commitment pose challenges for all denominations: the Christian scene has changed immeasurably in my life time and will continue to do so. We also live in a world which makes many more regulatory demands on churches and other voluntary organisations.

Andy rightly notes the pre-existence of the County Associations and suggests that their merger into larger Regional ones both undermined peoples’ sense of local togetherness and increased their sense of distance from the “centre. Having seen a similar process take place in the United Reformed Church, I agree. I would further suggest that this “lack of connectedness” has been exacerbated by the very real difficulty of making Assembly, Council and Steering Group truly representative of the churches. Despite efforts to make these more diverse, they inevitably attract “keen” people who, moreover, are able to give the time required. It does seem to me that the local churches are paying less and less interest to these bodies’ deliberations, initiatives and decisions.

We know that “Didcot” has had to lose a lot of staff over recent years. It does of course retain vital functions such as overseeing ministerial accreditation, property trusts, legal matters, safeguarding and ecumenical affairs. I for one am grateful for these. Much of the work formerly done at Baptist House seems to have been devolved to the Regional Associations, which (in theory at least) know and can be responsive to local situations. This in turn has led to an increase in Association staff although the Associations do not seem to provide the specialist support offered by their equivalents in other denominations (e.g. Diocesan children’s workers in the Church of England). One wonders if the current arrangements offer the best value for money and give churches the optimum level of resourcing. I suspect that a lot of churches actually work more-or-less independently of the Union and their Association until they hit a problem, at which point they seek help. But such help may be difficult to offer as the people being asked for assistance have little or no prior relationship with the church that needs it.

Andy offers two scenarios for the future; there may be others. I certainly have no easy solution to the challenges facing our Union; but, as Andy says, it is vital that searching questions are asked. The task of those asking them is not to secure the future of the Union as it stands, but to create a lean and fit body that will enhance the life of its churches “on the ground”.

Andrew Kleissner (Rev.),
Christchurch United Church, Llanedeyrn, Cardiff


 

Re: Churches' petition opposing Illegal Migration Bill submitted to 10 Downing Street

As an immigrant to the UK myself, I wish these Baptist groups would focus on the Gospel and stop being so divisive.
Will Hall (via Facebook)


Will Hall, thank you for your response. As a minister who signed the petition for me this is a Gospel issue, as we are welcomed into the Kingdom of God so we welcome people who need a home into our country. I believe we should be a nation that welcomes the lost, that obeys international law and honours the dignity of all people created in the image of God.

For centuries we were a missionary nation (not perfect) but we desired to take the Good News to all nations, now all nations are coming to us, this is a Gospel opportunity.

Finally, the Good News of Jesus is political because it speaks of a Kingdom of God that is different from the Kingdoms of this World. When we say Jesus is Lord, it says that all Governments are not as powerful as they like to think.

I am glad you feel welcomed into this country, I pray that many more can be welcomed too.
Michael Shaw (via Facebook)


I think we would agree that governments are not the answer - they are the problem. Jesus is the answer. So let's take our eyes off the government and stop trying to beg them for mercy when we have heavenly mercy for our Lord. The government is failing us in every way. I am glad to be a Baptist and fully support the separation of church and state. That's why it saddens me to see so many asking the government to be the saviour.

As an immigrant to the UK, I've spent over £10,000 to live in this nation (my previous employers have had to pay more on top of that). It seems that your petition would create different classes of people - a system which punishes those who work hard and do things legally. But if we want to throw out the legal system, I can think of many more laws and regulations that should go away before the immigration policy. Let's start with abortion, for one. Nearly 10 million unborn have been killed in this country - yet where is the statement from the public issues team on that?!

I do understand that everything is a Gospel issue. But this is a very divisive issue, and it's alienating people like me. We're not going to win the world for Jesus by battling over woke causes.
Will Hall (via Facebook)


Thanks Will. You were welcomed here because you are Western, spoke the language and had all the correct paperwork. You are acceptable to this Government.

I am a fully paid up member to the separation of church and state team. I do not think Government can be our Saviour but we have a prophetic responsibility to hold Government to account, to seek justice and to ask for mercy. That is a Biblical mandate.

You may consider this to be "divisive" but the desire to seek justice for others often is and 1,500 ministers across many different denominations seem to feel the same.

Finally, why do you make the assumption than in signing a petition we are not also preaching the Gospel both by doing that, and in serving the communities to which we are called?
Michael Shaw (via Facebook)


It's not 'the boats' and the people in them that the Government should be looking to stop. It's the criminal gangs behind them that the Government crack down on.
Fiona Patterson-Cheek (via Facebook)


Fiona, Agreed. However, given that most that arrive and claim asylum are granted it then if there were safe routes for refugees the market for traffickers would be reduced.

Let me express this in another way, by NOT providing safe routes for refugees the government is in reality supporting the criminal gangs. This is dog whistle politics, the illegal migration bill is designed to appeal to a particular subset of the population and shore up the Tory vote in local and the forthcoming General Election. It's for UKIPers, Reform, and those who have bought into the 'hate the immigrant' rhetoric etc. 

The poor management of those awaiting processing is the governments fault too, they exacerbate the problem and somehow blame someone else for the problem. It's about time this government were held to account.
Steve Parker (via Facebook)